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IN SPIRITUAL FORMATION DISCUSSION
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Black People in the Conversation
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TOPIC: Black People in the Conversation
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Maurice


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Black People in the Conversation
Friday July 22, 2005 3:08 PM
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i just wanted to share where i was. this is an excerpt from a (believe if or not) longer rant in my blog

http://www.mauricebroaddus.com/2005/07/BLACK-people-in-conver sation.htm

Let me put the nature of my dilemma in context. As another postmodern brother put it, I feel like I’ve been on a bit of a Sankofa lately. ("Sankofa" is an Akan word which means, "one must return to the past in order to move forward.") I've been going through a bit of an identity crisis, trying to work through my faith first as a Christian, then as a BLACK man. I’ve already spoken about my spiritual journey, but obviously I’m not done yet.

In a lot of ways, the emergent church struck me as, well, the Christian equivalent of the grunge movement. A little subversive, a little edgy, and whole lot of white, middle class evangelicals trying to make Christianity look cool. In other words, originally I saw a lot of style over substance. However, once I dug a little deeper, read some of the foundational works, a lot of the substance of postmodernism resonated. I was left wondering how this would translate to BLACK churches, wondering what an emergent African American church would look like or what a multi-cultural emergent church would look like. Better put, what would a multi-cultural church look like that drew on all worship traditions? Because, let me tell you, I ain’t feeling guitars, candles, and labyrinths. I love organs, drums, and gospel choirs way too much to give them up. Of course, part of this stems from the fact that we could all stand with a bigger definition of worship.

I guess I should start with whether or not BLACK churches are in need of being a part of the conversation. It may sound elitist to say, but there were some issues that the historic BLACK church managed to escape; some Postmodern leanings that have always been a part of who and what the BLACK church is. For instance, we’ve been doing narrative theology from the jump. Looking back on the history of BLACK Christianity, we had no choice but to focus on a narrative presentation of the faith, rather than on the development of a metaphysical system which attempted to draw infallible logical inferences from the Bible, reducing it to data in need of organizing. Not to say that this didn’t become more of an issue in the rise of seminary trained pastors, but by then, narrative theology was a part of the tradition.

Worship has always been experiential within the tradition of the BLACK church. People tend to look at BLACK churches and think that the attenders were in it for the emotional ride. Sure, we are an affective people, but it is a cognitive affectiveness: we feel the truth and worship is (intuitively) experiential. The emotional ride of worship has to be done within the narrative of the Gospel. Okay, I may have a bit of rose colored glasses on. Plenty of folks in my neighborhood go for the weekly show and the hollerin’, then come home and cause a ruckus during the rest of the week.

The historic BLACK church has also been more missional in nature also. It had to be, given its context within the BLACK community. BLACK people had had enough hell on earth to have to wait on the promise of an eternal heaven. Things had to start changing now, thus why the Church (big ‘c’, not solely the African American church) was the home of the Emancipation movement, Civil Rights movement, and has always set a tone of being a liberating presence in the community. With issues of poverty and economic and social justice at its forefront, the church, historically, has been socially conscious and thus relevant.

Yet the BLACK church, too, has felt the sting of modernism and has seen its effectiveness lessened. How else can we explain our youth seeking a sense of family in gangs rather than in church? The decline of men in church attendance? The continuing break up of BLACK families? As Brian Mclaren says of modernity and the church, what we think happened is that modern culture has been, in some ways, spiritually an arid place. It's been spiritually a place that there wasn't much room for authentic and communal spirituality. And so modernity brought us down." We think that the church has, in many ways, already accommodated to modernity. And so the Christian message has become a product almost, and it and the methods of spreading it are like sales pitches. We feel that it has been individualized.

I have seen several modern tendencies infiltrate the BLACK church. I am greatly concerned by this rise in the “health and wealth” Gospel (have enough faith and healing and money comes your way). Being in bed with nationalistic politics is no different from white evangelicals flexing their political power within the Republican party. And the perception of the pastor as (mini-) pope, well any overly pastor-centered church is in danger of becoming simply a cult of personality.

With the diagnosis in place, the next step is figuring out what our traditions of faith are and what we bring to the table. A friend blogged about Negro spirituals as subversive Christian practice. Musically, I’d love to see jazz incorporated more, maybe a worship team that is part jazz ensemble (this is a style issue, a reaction to white evangelical churches doing 70s era light right as choruses and calling it worship). The movie Rize has driven home the importance of dance as and in worship.

As I continue to think through this, I am exploring the Coptic Orthodoxy–a branch of Christianity that, according to tradition, the apostle Mark established in Egypt in the middle of the 1st century–and seeing what they have to offer in terms of practices.

I still might not find what I’m looking for. And maybe the critics of Emergent may have some valid points. I know that Brian McLaren is purposefully broadening the conversation in Africa and South America. There’s one thing that can’t be denied, however: when all is said and done, at least the Emergent movement allows for this sort of conversation. A conversation long overdue.
check out the new look of www.MauriceBroaddus.com
Message #214376

davidevans


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Friday July 22, 2005 8:08 PM
REPLY
Maurice
Thank you for your post I found it very interesting. The only thing I could make an observation on (probably due to my ignorance) is that as long as there is a designation as "a BLACK church" then we are definitely in need of the BLACK church being part of the conversation. Christianity unfortunately is more racially divided by choice than any other institution left in the U.S. That in itself is a terrible indictment for the faith that proclaims there is no gentile or jew and that we are all one in Christ
"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience,
we are spiritual beings having a human experience."
Pierre Teilhard de Chardin

Message #214425 - This was a reply to message #214376

DesertPastor


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 8:11 AM
REPLY
QUOTED 

i just wanted to share where i was


Glad you did, Maurice!

QUOTED 

In a lot of ways, the emergent church struck me as, well, the Christian equivalent of the grunge movement. A little subversive, a little edgy, and whole lot of white, middle class evangelicals trying to make Christianity look cool.


Despite the fact that you ended up seeing past this, this remains a first impression for a lot of people. Ignoring such impressions certainly doesn't encourage engagement with "the conversation."
Continue exploring the mysteries of life and faith at Paradoxology, or join me as I pursue A Call to an Ancient Evangelical Future.
Message #214482 - This was a reply to message #214376

DesertPastor


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 8:23 AM
REPLY
QUOTED 

However, once I dug a little deeper, read some of the foundational works, a lot of the substance of postmodernism resonated. I was left wondering how this would translate to BLACK churches...


Some believe that the African-American church (by and large) already is operating within a post-modern paradigm, without the modernist liabilities of Western, caucasian congregations -- and there may be some truth to that. This might be part of the reason you're resonating with postmodernism.

QUOTED 

Better put, what would a multi-cultural church look like that drew on all worship traditions?


This is a good question, and one which I share with you. Some people still doubt whether this should even be a realistic goal of the Church, but if earthly worship (at least in part) is meant to be modeled after heavenly worship, then we cannot afford to let go of this vision and goal.
Continue exploring the mysteries of life and faith at Paradoxology, or join me as I pursue A Call to an Ancient Evangelical Future.
Message #214486 - This was a reply to message #214376

DesertPastor


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 8:36 AM
REPLY
QUOTED 

Because, let me tell you, I ain’t feeling guitars, candles, and labyrinths. I love organs, drums, and gospel choirs way too much to give them up. Of course, part of this stems from the fact that we could all stand with a bigger definition of worship.


Excellent!

I think the more people move past style and into substance, the more they would totally agree.

QUOTED 

I have seen several modern tendencies infiltrate the BLACK church. I am greatly concerned by this rise in the “health and wealth” Gospel (have enough faith and healing and money comes your way). Being in bed with nationalistic politics is no different from white evangelicals flexing their political power within the Republican party. And the perception of the pastor as (mini-) pope, well any overly pastor-centered church is in danger of becoming simply a cult of personality.


Well, you certainly put your finger on three "biggies" haven't you? Your insights here are dead-on. Another influence that modernity has injected into both BLACK and white churches has been "individualism" -- with it's out-of-balance emphasis on self-importance, self-affirmation, and the overruling rights of the individual (often at the expense of community).
Continue exploring the mysteries of life and faith at Paradoxology, or join me as I pursue A Call to an Ancient Evangelical Future.
Message #214489 - This was a reply to message #214376

DesertPastor


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 8:42 AM
REPLY
QUOTED 

I still might not find what I’m looking for. And maybe the critics of Emergent may have some valid points. I know that Brian McLaren is purposefully broadening the conversation in Africa and South America. There’s one thing that can’t be denied, however: when all is said and done, at least the Emergent movement allows for this sort of conversation. A conversation long overdue.


Well summarized. It's obvious that you're in the middle of the "tensions" which characterize the entire Emergent movement. There are many both-and realities present in all this (which I suspect you're aware of). I'm really glad that you have joined the conversation here at TheOoze. We need more voices like yours.

I apologize for being a bit long-winded in posting so much in response, but I felt that your topic and post here warranted it.

- DP
Continue exploring the mysteries of life and faith at Paradoxology, or join me as I pursue A Call to an Ancient Evangelical Future.
Message #214490 - This was a reply to message #214376

love4theword


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 8:47 AM
REPLY
QUOTED 

http://www.mauricebroaddus.com/2005/07/BLACK-people-in-conver sation.htm


Here's an active link:

BLACK People in the Conversation


QUOTED 

As I continue to think through this, I am exploring the Coptic Orthodoxy–a branch of Christianity that, according to tradition, the apostle Mark established in Egypt in the middle of the 1st century–and seeing what they have to offer in terms of practices.


St Moses the Ethiopian rocks man. Good choice, but don't limit yourself to just one branch of Orthodoxy. I've come to the growing conclusion that without all 3 streams of the faith Protestant, Roman Catholic & Eastern Orthodox we don't have 'The Church'. Btw have you read the book An Unbroken Circle: Linking Ancient African Christianity to the African-American Experience If not, 8th day has it fairly cheap and I recommend it.

QUOTED 

I have seen several modern tendencies infiltrate the BLACK church. I am greatly concerned by this rise in the “health and wealth” Gospel (have enough faith and healing and money comes your way). Being in bed with nationalistic politics is no different from white evangelicals flexing their political power within the Republican party. And the perception of the pastor as (mini-) pope, well any overly pastor-centered church is in danger of becoming simply a cult of personality.


Preach Preacher!!!

Amen.

QUOTED 

The historic BLACK church has also been more missional in nature also. It had to be, given its context within the BLACK community. BLACK people had had enough hell on earth to have to wait on the promise of an eternal heaven.


I have to agree. I know that as a white man that has belonged/attended BLACK churches my welcome their was always warm and friendly. I see you are a BLACK man married to a white woman. I am a white man married to a BLACK woman. I wonder if your and my wife's experience of white churches would be the same? certainly not as welcoming as the BLACK churches.

And I have to confess some churches asked us not to fellowship with them.....

I'd hate to be them come Judgement day. My wife is convinced that if you are racist, the Jesus you will be judged by on judgement day will be the colour you couldn't stand on the earth.

QUOTED 

I still might not find what I’m looking for.


This is true. Be encouraged and remember Christianity for a long time was called the "Way". Sometimes the Journey is more important. And I'm not sure we'll find what we are looking for this side of the beatific vision - Heaven - Divinization.

and I for one am really glad you are here.

Welcome to the Ooze.

LYB

I'shalom

Seraphim
"We generally find it easier to understand what is complex; what is simple is too demanding"

-Father Hans Urs Von Balthasar

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mayrussian


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Saturday July 23, 2005 10:30 AM
REPLY
Maurice,
I'm so glad you're here! In early June/late May, in a thread I called 'America is not the center of the world', I said the following:

QUOTED 

I must bring up a painfully obvious thing about theOoze:
Most of us are Americans, and from what I've seen of the demographics. . . most of us are white. Even the ones who live in different countries (like me) are American. In saying this, I am aware of our brothers and sisters represented from Britain, Australia, and New Zealand. . . and I do not want to make light of that. And I see on the home page that over 90 countries are represented. . . how many of them are Americans living and serving in those countries?

Is this conversation that we're in 'slanted' due to its demographics? What are people thinking in other parts of the world about post-modernism, the church, and such?


I feel like I could quote your entire post and respond to it. I just want to let you know I'm glad you're here, because you are an essential part of this conversation. I was reading your thoughts, and totally nodding my head through most of it.

Thanks for your thoughts. I've added your blog to my 'favorites' list, and look forward to reading more.
Resurrection. . . is the mysterious, utterly deep and real, stunning-the-surrounding-world metamorphosis which, from a narrow circle of transient history, brings forth gospel events in a measure that is visible from any point of the globe and from any century. --Alexander Men
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EDGEHOG


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Monday July 25, 2005 10:11 AM
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totally...I just posted something to this effect on the what does emerging ministry look like..."run by a rich white young man?"

Hmmm...my brother is BLACK and we have similar experiences. I think growing up in white church circles has turned him a bit oreo. He is changing as he spends more time in other cultures in London.

What do you think can be done? In my experience the biggest 'BLACK church'in the UK is very NOT emerging but pastor centred pentecostalism...

Eh
Please sir, can I have some more?
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Maurice


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RE: Black People in the Conversation
Tuesday July 26, 2005 4:45 PM
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wow, thanks guys.

i was honestly worried how this would go over.

"An Unbroken Circle: Linking Ancient African Christianity to the African-American Experience" wow. thanks for the book recommendation. this sounds like something i've been looking for. there are a couple other pomo-brothers that i've pointed here. hopefully they'll start posting.

i'm not sure what can be done. other than to reach out, ask questions, and be willing to listen. that's what we're going to be doing with churches in the area.
check out the new look of www.MauriceBroaddus.com
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